Logan's Urban Desert Garden

[leftylogan]

I like these and wanted to start my own since I'm starting from practically nothing but have enough experience that I should get going pretty quickly. I live in the east valley of the Phoenix Metro in a build-to-rent and this is my backyard. I have the large space at approximately 25' W x 40' L for ~1000 square feet of usable space. We'll see how much I can fill before my girlfriend complains about living in a jungle. I think I have space for 4 rows but 3 will be easy.



and



I have no reason to build beds even though we plan on living here for a few years so I'll be entirely in grow bags and containers. I will be spending a lot of money on dirt lol. The rocks are going to be a PITA I know it.

[leftylogan]

I did some transplanting today out of the 72 cell seed starter and into 3.5 inch pots. 18 pots fit in a standard 1020 tray. Seedlings were started in (loose) Jiffy Mix and transplats went into to a mix of Burpee coir seed starting mix (brick), perlite, and mushroom compost with some 10-10-10 granules mixed in.

Before. I had a couple of cucumbers and zucchini already in pots but filled the rest.


After. I transplanted Sunflowers, Squash, Tomatillos, Cantaloupe, 1 pepper, 1 tomato, thyme, and basil today. I'll do a variety list in a separate post (I also have more seeds on the way... oops).



and



and then back in their home in my office on heat mats with the pink lights I accidentally ordered instead of white lights. I also should have bought a bigger shelf but I wanted to limit myself (lmao). With a 5 tier I could sell plants to recoup some costs and supplement the day job. Daydreams...



I need a stand grow light to utilize my ~17 year old plug in greenhouse that somehow hasn't rotted.

[leftylogan]

2025 Variety List as of 2/12

I'm only listing things that have germinated

Tomato

• Black Krim
• Green Zebra
• Brandywine - 2009 seed!
• Flathead Monster Orange - 2010 seed! - This is either crossed or wasn't stable cool
• Chocolate Cherry - 2011 seed!
• Dwarf Wild Fred - 2010 seed!
• Dinky Purple F4 from the dwarf project - 2009 seed!
• Muddy Pink F4 from the dwarf project - 2009 seed!
• Captain Lucky
• Arkansas Traveler
• Galina's (Yellow)
• Chadwick Cherry
• (Dwarf) Wherokowhai
• White Beauty
• Dancing With Smurfs
• Orange Strawberry
• Sunchocola F1
• Sun Sugar
• Mega Tom Giant Tomato
• Golden Dwarf Champion - 2009 seed!
• (Dwarf) Summer Sunrise - 2010 seed!

Hot Pepper

• Jalapeno
• Fresno
• Sugar Rush Peach
• Santa Fe Grande

Sweet/Mild Pepper

• Banana
• Sweet Keystone Giant Bell
• Shishito
• Big Jim
• Mini Yellow Bell

Tomatillo

• Green (lol)

Melon

• Charentais (Cantaloupe)
• Sugar Baby Watermelon

Zucchini & Squash

• Fordhook Zucchini
• Golden Scallop Squash

Cucumbers

• Spacemaster

Herbs

• English Thyme
• Lettuce Leaf Basil
• Cinnamon Basil
• Purple Ruffles Basil

Flowers

• Red Sun Sunflower
• Black Hollyhock
• Moulin Rouge (hybrid) Sunflower
• Ring of Fire Sunflowers
• Vanilla Cream (hybrid) Marigold
• Fordhook Giants Hollyhock
• Country Romance Hollyhock
• Blue Boy Bachelor's Buttons
• Cut & Come Again Zinnias
• Sunshine mix Gazania
• Double mixed Portulaca (Moss Rose)

Eggplant

• Black Beauty
• Listada de Gandia

[JayneR13]

Wow! That looks like a great start! And if you're a seedaholic, you'll fit in quite well around here. There's not a person on this board who can walk by a seed rack and not at least look! Have you grown in containers before?

[MissS]

You have had some great germination. Seed that is dried properly should be viable for years and years. You are off to a great start. This year will be a learnig experience and I wish you a prosperous journey.

[leftylogan]

Wow! That looks like a great start! And if you're a seedaholic, you'll fit in quite well around here. There's not a person on this board who can walk by a seed rack and not at least look! Have you grown in containers before?

Thanks! Definitely a seedaholic, I like to be paralyzed by choices when choosing what to grow and then just start everything I own anyways . I've probably done most of my growing in containers but the grow bags will be a new experience. I worked at a wholesale nursery complex for a season and had ~15 greenhouses full of containers and hanging baskets to manage and grow. I have a harder time with in-ground gardening and the increased variables in the soil building.

Before



After

[JayneR13]

I’ve grown in grow bags and I think you’ll find it similar to containers, only more drainage. I found them god for growing potatoes on my deck. I’m sure you’re well aware that potting soil isn’t actually soil, right? It took me ten years to learn that!

I love your greenhouse

[leftylogan]

I’ve grown in grow bags and I think you’ll find it similar to containers, only more drainage. I found them god for growing potatoes on my deck. I’m sure you’re well aware that potting soil isn’t actually soil, right? It took me ten years to learn that!

I love your greenhouse

When does soilless potting soil become actual soil is one of my favorite internet arguments! I spend enough time evaluating massive soil pits for wastewater treatment as part of my job so I'm looking forward to the lack of "soil" in all the containers.

Thanks! It was easy to go to work in those greenhouses when they looked like that even if I was there for 60 hours a week watering. I'll definitely take my current (mostly) desk job over doing that permanently even though it was a lot of fun for the season I worked.

[leftylogan]

I was swamped at work so I didn't get to do much throughout the week. It's supposed to be in the 80's the next couple of days and high 70's after that with lows in the 50's. We might have one more short cold snap but I would say winter is basically over.

In my best Pauly D/Jersey Shore voice - Bags are here!



12 each of 5, 7, 10 & 20 gallon grow bags.




I filled some leftover nursery pots and a few of the grow bags. ~66 nursery gallons of homemade potting mix to get warm for the first set of plants.



Here's my mixing station. Various amounts of coco coir, peat, perlite, bark mulch, "organic garden soil" that was mostly bark fines, and mushroom compost.



Some of these early plants got some nice outside time today



I have lots of potting up that I didn't get to today. My potting up mix got rained on so that's drying out as seen above. It should be dry tomorrow or Monday whenever I have some time to work on some peppers and tomatoes.

[leftylogan]

Some extra musings/thoughts after mixing a ton of potting soil today.

1 - I knew I was going to need a ton of initial supplies but I still think I underestimated (what else is new)

2 - It's going to be so nice to just amend existing potting mix next year after it bakes off for a little bit.

3 - I'm going to need a lot of those 27 gallon tubs to store mix in-between plantings

4 - I'm going to need a long water wand like I used as a "pro" once I get plants in the pots

5 - I prefer peat but coco is so much more sustainable. I'm sure the answer is go to a 50/50 mix since that's the sweet spot around most "sustainability" related things

6 - On a similar sustainability thought - I think I'll continue using perlite/vermiculite to get the bulk of my mix made this year but I'd like to find a source of rice hulls moving forward. Brewing stores seem like the best option from my searching but I'll see if the local nursery chain can source some

7 - Pallets to get the containers off the rocks might be a good idea

8 - I need to get my butt in gear with the rest of my veggies so I can start on the cut flowers to appease my girlfriend

9 - updated my variety list in an earlier post with more germination from the seed mail I received this week (I can't help myself)

[Whwoz]

Rice hulls are often used here for animal bedding, especially calves. if there are farm feed supply stores about you might find it there, or they may be able to get some in for you.

Likewise with pallets, good idea, but have a look around for plastic ones if you can, much more durable.

Number 9 means you fit right at home with the rest of us, nothing to be ashamed of.

[PlainJane]

Yes, raising the containers off the ground is a good idea.
Soil ingredients are typically the biggest expenditure after grow lights, perhaps. At least after the initial burst it usually settles down unless you do a big expansion.
I use a mix of coco coir, compost, fertilizer and pine bark fines for my tomato grow mix. No peat. I’ve got a great local source of pine bark fines; you will have to see what you can lay hands on.

[JayneR13]

I don't want to argue the philosophical/scientific ins and outs of when soil-less mixes actually become soil. My opinion is based purely upon the results. I'd have the most beautiful plants for a month or so, then once the NPK was used the plants became diseased and didn't produce. This is a problem, and mixing one's own certainly can solve it. I would toss mine into my raised beds at the end of the season. In my mind, that made it soil. I learned to mix my own from this though, and you have a decent recipe. I use 1/2 compost and 1/2 potting mix for my containers now, and it works a LOT better. You might look at places that sell mushroom supplies for rice hulls. Soy hulls are pretty common there and might help if you can't find rice.

Yeah, don't worry about being a seedaholic around here. You fit right in! None of us will say one word or discourage you in any way.

[leftylogan]

Appreciate the rice hull sourcing advice everyone. For how important agriculture was to this part of the Phoenix area, it's non-existent any more. And I literally live on a demolished orange grove. Tractor Supply only has chicken supplies even lol. Now if I only I could keep chickens with all the current egg problems. I just want to bake for cheap again...

[leftylogan]

It was 86 today so the first tray of plants has been enjoying a ton of outside time and are chugging water. Some of them had to have grown 3 inches today but I didn't get a picture. I also didn't notice any sunburn.

It was too nice out to be stuck inside on my work computer all day so I ignored all my emails after 12 and potted up another tray of seedlings. Mostly peppers and tomatoes but there's some hollyhocks in there too.



I need more perlite before I start my flower seeds. I'm liking the addition of extra perlite to jiffy mix as it drains better for getting things started. I also need tons more perlite in general ugh.

Waiting on the 10-day lows to get a little warmer before I paper towel sprout/direct seed some beans to try and sneak in 1 crop of bush plants before it gets too hot.

I was hoping I would be able to pawn more extra plants off on my parents but they only requested a cherry tomato, a slicer, and a pepper or two. Hopefully some of my or the gf's coworkers want some. I'm sure I can find room for them...

Variety list updated again. Mostly peppers since they should still do okay with the late start.

[JayneR13]

Indeed, the American Southwest isn't exactly farm country! I remember when I lived in Southern California, how we had to water trees pretty much every day to keep them alive. As a kid I didn't think much about the water bill but now, I shudder to think! Oof!

I give you credit for doing what you can do to help yourself. The times haven't been easy since before Covid and I don't see things getting better any time soon. Are there native edibles that you can grow, that would be better adapted to your environment?

[leftylogan]

@JayneR13 Native edibles are pretty slim outside of prickly pears and the Mesquite and Palo Verde legume trees. There's a few other things floating around https://www.nativeseeds.org/ that are interesting, mostly melons and tepary beans. To the best of my knowledge our native tribes utilized mostly Three Sisters type agriculture and the Mormon's didn't do things too differently either later on.

One could argue that most Solanaceae are pseudo-natives, we're just lacking the elevation that the South/Central American origin sites has. I don't think a lot of people realize most of the Phoenix Metro is at 1000 ft above sea level. One of my favorite fun facts for the sports people out there is that Phoenix has the 2nd highest elevation MLB and NFL stadiums behind only Denver.

[JayneR13]

Interesting. I have some Hopi pale gray squash seed that might do well for you, assuming you like squash. If you'd like some seeds shoot me a PM.

Hey, cats are pseudo-natives at this point too. They're here and they're staying, right? By native, I was referring to varieties that would do better in your area, ie varieties that have been there long enough to have evolved somewhat to local conditions. You and I can both grow tomatoes, but I'm sure we use different varieties for that reason. Even the same variety grown in two such different areas will evolve a bit differently.

[leftylogan]

Interesting. I have some Hopi pale gray squash seed that might do well for you, assuming you like squash. If you'd like some seeds shoot me a PM.

Hey, cats are pseudo-natives at this point too. They're here and they're staying, right? By native, I was referring to varieties that would do better in your area, ie varieties that have been there long enough to have evolved somewhat to local conditions. You and I can both grow tomatoes, but I'm sure we use different varieties for that reason. Even the same variety grown in two such different areas will evolve a bit differently.

I'm not a huge fan of squash but I'm hoping that's a variety/growing conditions issue. This is my first time growing it for myself so if it goes well I will absolutely take you up on that at some point, thank you!

I've had a tough time finding anything to your second point. From a lot of my research I've noticed that there's a focus on either dry or hot & humid for adaptations but not hot & dry. I think it's an area with a lot of room for improvement and I will be selecting for fruit set in hot conditions among other things. I have a lot of issues with the landrace/Lofthouse style of breeding but it does a good job emphasizing the ecology aspect of plant populations that I think is ignored in other hobby plant breeding circles

[leftylogan]

My plants enjoyed the 80+ degree days and lots of sunlight this week. There's supposed to be a slight cool down and a chance of rain next weekend when I'll be out of town (of course) but then it warms back up so many are very close to going in their final homes. The top left tray is permanently outside now and the others will be joining them gradually. I baby my plants too much and leave 2-liters filled with water next to them overnight because why not. Most everything got a bottom feeding of diluted basic miracle grow liquid plant food throughout the week too.



Filled 4 x 20 gallon grow bags today for the cucumbers + cantaloupe + zucchini + sunflowers(?). They'll sit in the sun and get warm before a few things probably go in them



My seed starting tray is full again because I'm an addict but it's mostly flowers so that doesn't count.